r/funny May 04 '21

But i like what i have okay?

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u/mattdotnet May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

My mom bought her house for $120k in the 90's. It just got appraised for $600k. Me and my wife make under 100k and either have to move away from both our families or rent until we die. It's pretty fucking cool.

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u/37yearoldthrowaway May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

$120k is worth about $260k in today's dollars adjusted for inflation. Not only that, the average mortgage interest rate in 1990 was 10.1%. With today's rate around 3.0%, the monthly mortgage cost of a $120k house in 1990 would be roughly equivalent to a $525,000 house today.

Edit: This doesn't even factor in the decent increase in square footage of most houses today verse 30-40 years ago. I'd argue that for anywhere other than VHCOL areas (SF/Seattle/NY), that the price per square foot is "relatively" cheaper than it was back then, adjusting for inflation and current interest rates. Unfortunately, it's also impossible to buy a new 1,200 sq ft house anymore because they just don't build them that small.

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u/Bull_City May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

Ooh this is a good adjustment. Most people just do inflation, but housing is so sensitive to interest rates. Mind sending a link or something how the math works for adjusting inflation by the interest rate calculation?

The other thing I don’t think a lot of people appreciate is that with higher prices means that first step on the ladder has gotten way bigger (20% of a much higher number), which is a sort of cheapening of the purchasing power of wages too.

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u/tertgvufvf May 04 '21

Down payment is often the biggest hurdle. Mortgage payments might be less than you're currently paying in rent, but doesn't matter if you can't save that down payment (because of the sky high rent...)

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u/First_Foundationeer May 04 '21

You can always put a lot less down with certain programs (first time homeowners, for example), but another hurdle is beating out other offers which may be fucking $100k over asking.

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u/lumaleelumabop May 04 '21

Or offering above asking price with a pre-approved loan and grear interest rate only to lose to a cash buyer...

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u/prfessorY May 04 '21

Literally happened to me a week ago.

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u/W0666007 May 04 '21

Has happened to me 3 times in the past 6 weeks. Expecting it to happen a 4th time on the house I just put an offer on.

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u/EightiesBush May 04 '21

Why does the seller care if the buyer pays with cash? They still get the money in the same amount of time regardless if it's all cash or a bank loan, right?

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u/prfessorY May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

Cash mean the buyer has the full amount on hand. Financing can fall through for a number of reasons between making an offer and closing. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or missing info.

Edit: also when financing you typically put contingencies on your offer. The bank will make sure the house is actually worth what they are paying for it, this is an appraisal contingency. And/or it'll be contintingent upon an inspection, to make sure the house is livable, safe, and functioning properly.

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u/First_Foundationeer May 04 '21

Yeah, at some point, you may have to hope that you have parents who already have a house and are willing to take a loan out so that you can do an all cash offer, then refinance to pay them back and set up a normal mortgage. It's kind of insane that it's shifted so crazily.

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u/feralhogger May 04 '21

This is an issue where I live. Housing is cheap, but so are wages, and if you want a house, you gotta compete with some investor making coastal city money who wants some passive income. Lots of places selling, but it’s not the owners moving in.

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u/waxillium_ladrian May 04 '21

This happened recently to a couple I know. They found a house they loved, bid $20K over asking, and were outbid.

The house was up for rent a couple weeks later.

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u/First_Foundationeer May 04 '21

Yeah. Depending on your location and seller, a good cover letter can help a lot. Sure, someone else might bid a bit more than you, but the seller may prefer to sell to a young couple who will stay in the area and cherish the property over an international rent/airbnb business. I mean, it depends on the seller and how much more they bid..

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u/DrSoccerDad May 04 '21

I second this! My wife and I bought a house in the Boston suburbs last Fall (insane housing market) and there was another offer that came in about $10-15k over ours and the seller asked what we do for work because the other buyer was a local real estate guy. I’m a teacher and my wife is a social worker and the very nice old man selling the place was absolutely thrilled to sell to us.

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u/Omephla May 04 '21

My old neighbors just did this on the selling end (thank god since we live in a townhome). She sold to a single, middle-aged lady instead of an out-of-state investor who would have rented it out. The old neighbors took the lower offer (not by much ~ maybe a $1000) for no other reason than looking out for us.

Nothing against renters, I was at one point, but, they/we just don't care as much as an owner does/will.

We repaid their kindness with a lovely dinner at our place and have remained close friends since (and gained a new one with the new owner).

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u/THofTheShire May 04 '21

we bought our first home with an FHA loan at something like 4% down, and I am eternally grateful that was available. It made a huge difference in our net worth over the last decade to be owners and not renters.

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u/EightiesBush May 04 '21

I'm in the same boat as you, definitely is insane how much your net worth grows buying vs renting. Getting out of the PMI is a lot trickier now though for these programs; it doesn't automatically fall off when you hit 22% ownership anymore.

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u/Jdorty May 04 '21

People are also making all these comparisons while we're in the middle of huge boom in building, real estate, and housing in general. Make the comparisons from 30 years ago against costs 1.5-2 years ago, or wait for the market to crash, or at least go down/level out.

In markets that move in waves, you can't just compare the peaks with lows from years ago. Or even with averages vs peaks.

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u/cloake May 04 '21

Housing never goes down anymore.

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u/DogmaticNuance May 04 '21

Yeah, GI bill got us on the ladder. They don't even give you money, just underwrite the loan so you can put down less than 20% and not have to pay mortgage insurance.

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u/natilyfe May 04 '21

Any good links for VA loan info. All the gov sites just have the same basic info

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u/DOGSraisingCATS May 04 '21

Exactly. I was able to save for a downoayment because the company I worked for covered my rent for 2 years(while working remote) and now I'm staying at a family condo, for free, that my mom isn't using currently until I close. Privilege comes in many forms and I didn't grow up rich but definitely recognize the benefits I have with just a supportive and financially stable family.

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u/bob256k May 04 '21

I hate to tell you this but rich is relative. To ALOT of people in the world, even in the USA, this is wealthy beyond their dreams. I do alright and I have never had a job even a 6 figure one, offer to cover my rent.

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u/Luvs_to_drink May 04 '21

first time buyers can sometimes get away with only putting 3% down instead of the recommended 20%

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u/jargo1 May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

It’s also worth mentioning that almost no first time home buyers are putting down 20%. No one really has that amount of cash on hand. I just bought my first home and was considered an incredibly attractive and stable lendee due to being able to put 5% down and thus qualify for a conventional mortgage. You really only need 3% down to buy. You just have to contend with mortgage insurance until you build a certain amount of equity.

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u/avdpos May 04 '21

Amount needed to put down is so interestingly different between countries.

As extra safety after the financial crisis we in Sweden got the rule "never more than 85% in loan on houses". So you are forced to put down 15%, preferably in cash but a few use more expensive loans without security.

It do maybe makes the banks safer from going down. But the rule ain't helping first time buyers in any way. And saving for a house and seeing the prices go up 15+% the last year is really not feeling good.

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u/gentlewaterboarding May 04 '21

Didn't realize the situation in Sweden was exactly the same as the one in Norway. I'm currently saving for my 15 %.

I'm sort of thankful for the little bit of regulation. Seems to me like the housing market would be going even more crazy without it. Situation kinda sucks either way though.

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u/Money_Calm May 04 '21

I was so afraid of PMI but didn't realize its really not that bad

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u/BernadilloJune May 04 '21

Most people don't put 20% down these days because of that. The older generations don't understand that even with PMI and not excellent credit your PMI + interest will still be below 5% which is half the rate mentioned above. Hell we put 5% down on our house and our rate is less than 3.5% if you consider PMI an interest surcharge.

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u/onexbigxhebrew May 04 '21

Although, the one nice thing is that is the inflated part of the equation is something I own, vs. the inflated part being the interest.

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u/Nilsneo May 04 '21

Interesting. I've been poking around on Redfin in major cities and while hotspots in California like SF and the best parts of Los Angeles are right out, it's entirely possible to get a 525000 house further out still. Though with LA traffic that probably means "three hours drive" away.

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u/IslayHaveAnother May 04 '21

Absolutely. This is why telecommuting could seriously help a ton a of people. People need to be willing to relocate, and telecommuting (even if just three hours outside the city) will aid in that ability. I fully understand that not everyone can telecommute in their jobs, but it will help.

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u/Fabulous-Cow-64 May 04 '21

What’s crazy is that for months, my employer told us that we could telecommute indefinitely after Covid. They then changed their minds. Several people bought houses three or four hours from work but now will be unable to keep them. Thanks irrational business models!

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u/THofTheShire May 04 '21

We're actually seeing a negative effect of it here. All the people in the bay area who are able to work more remotely are buying in our area and driving inventory down and prices up. Generally good for people already invested in real estate, but bad for first time buyers and renters. You can't rent a space for one person for less than $1000/mo right now unless it's a bedroom in someone's home.

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u/Nilsneo May 04 '21

If, in urban centres, office jobs all become telecommuting ones, then the empty office buildings could be converted to apartments of various sizes for the people who can not commute but aren't exactly paid a fortune either, such as nurses, teachers, police, etc

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u/Youknowimtheman May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

The stupidly low rates are part of the mechanism driving housing prices up. See also: first time homebuyer credits, unregulated foreign investment, not enough building, lack of taxes on unoccupied homes.

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u/Bantwagon May 04 '21

This is true, and often gets missed in the discussion.

However, an additional outcome of "lowered interest rates = higher house prices" is that the size of the deposit required increases as well. In your example, the $260k house turning into a $520k house means that, at a 10% deposit, a first time buyer has to save up twice as much before they can get on the ladder (even if monthly payments are the same).

This is a huge barrier for those on below median earnings and means that many will no longer reach "escape velocity" where they can trade in expensive rent for an equity building mortgage.

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u/p-morais May 04 '21

The problem is rates will rise again but prices probably won’t go down.

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u/TrueSpins May 04 '21

You're forgetting that saving rates were equally high. Try saving for a deposit with interest rates around sub 1%. Works both ways.

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u/raven_785 May 04 '21

Just to hijack this good reply, it's also the case that the square footage of houses has greatly increased as well. Last year (before the pandemic drove the market bonkers) if you adjusted for inflation AND square footage your price per square foot really hasn't changed much for the country as a whole (local markets can obviously be a much different story) over the last several decades. In the 1950s the typical new home had only 950 square feet where today the average new home is about 2500 square feet. Most of those 1950s homes that are still around today have been expanded over the years (provided there's lot space available and basements to finish) or torn down and replaced.

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u/[deleted] May 04 '21

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u/skippyfa May 04 '21

Mom: Didn't wages also go up by 2000%?

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

"I made less than $3 an hour in 1972!!!" my grandfather arguing against a $15 minimum wage.... Okay gramps but that's roughly $19 in today's dollars.

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u/Janus_Grayden May 04 '21

Right? They'll talk about what they got paid in one breath and then the next, they'll talk any how you could buy a hamburger for a dime.

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u/nom_nom_nom_nom_lol May 04 '21

"Gasoline was only a nickel a gallon when I got my first car. Paid 300 bucks for it. Worked all summer mowing lawns to save up."

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u/KushyNuggets May 04 '21

My FIL has a job that pays nearly $150k/year and they're actively hiring 20 something year olds to replace him at 1/4 his salary. He still gets his $150k/year forever but the young guys get $40k/year. He brags about it. Disgusting. Boomer stuff.

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u/readwaytoooften May 04 '21

Unless he owns the company he's only going to be employed until it's worth it to the owner two keep the extra $100k for himself...

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u/IcarusOnReddit May 04 '21

That assumes the owner is rational. I have worked at many companies where that is very very untrue.

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u/thesaunders May 04 '21

I currently work for one of these!

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u/ajohns95616 May 04 '21

This was how my dad was laid off. Like 20 years ago.

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u/XboxOneDad May 04 '21

I don't understand this $150k forever stuff. Gen X here wants in on that deal.

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u/dweezil22 May 04 '21

It's easy, just be born 50 years ago and get a job with a pension, hang on for a few decades. Now roll a D20.

15+: Congratulations, you got raises and your pension held on and you get six figures for the rest of your life.

10+: You didn't get all the raises but you still get a decent $50k/yr pension plus your SS, which ain't bad

5+: Re-org! Your pension converts into an 401K type deal. If you die young this is good, otherwise it'll tap out 10 years into your retirement. Kinda sucks, but realistically it's all you would have saved with a 401k (this is where post-Boomers typically end up if they roll a 15).

< 5: Womp womp. Company got bought out and your pension rights got changed around age 50, when you were too young to get anything. Sorry you wasted 20 years of your life working towards the pension, better luck next life!

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u/Vincent210 May 04 '21

Can’t believe that < 5 scenario is even legal.

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u/ProlapsePatrick May 04 '21

They can take your entire pension?

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u/[deleted] May 04 '21

Its awful. Many many fields are facing that situation. Jobs that SHOULD be highly paid positions around 150k are not. Because of exactly that. There are so many people in the hiring pool that they can just ignore the people who know what theyre worth. Why take someone who demands a proper salary when you can hire the guy next to him who doesnt think hes worth anything.

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u/sevenstaves May 04 '21

Technically you can still buy a car for $300.

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u/FFF_in_WY May 04 '21

I think the comparison involves a working engine and transmission and various other functional nonsense. But a fully functional bicycle on the other hand..!

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u/et27U4Y4qse0AIcyFZg8 May 04 '21

But a fully functional bicycle on the other hand..!

Shit, have you been bike shopping lately? Anything not a plastic walmart bike will run you $300 minimum.

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u/PencilLeader May 04 '21

Can confirm, bought a new bike, cost just under $1000.

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u/swolemedic May 04 '21

Bruh, you can't even register a car for 300 dollars. I just changed my car's registration from NJ to OR and it cost me 400 bucks.

Sure, you can find a heap of metal that maybe turns on for 300 dollars but you aren't driving it on any roads for that price.

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u/the_silkworm May 04 '21

from NJ to OR

You really don't like to pump your own gas, do you?

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u/rtb001 May 04 '21

As an ex Oregonian it was a nice blast of nostalgia to get gas in New Jersey.

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u/lighten_up_n_laff May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

but you aren't driving it on any roads for that price.

its called ridin' dirty... *Chamillionaire made a whole song about it

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u/Topikk May 04 '21

sad Chamillionaire noises

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u/FerrisMcFly May 04 '21

My grandma was legit telling me how her mother used to send her to the store with 5$ to buy groceries for the week then asked why I didn't have a house yet in the next sentence.

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u/damasu950 May 04 '21

Sending a kid to buy the groceries sounds like a good way to end up living on Pixie Stix

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u/EmotionalKirby May 04 '21

Nowadays, sure. Back then, you'd get beat to an inch of your life if you even thought of pixie sticks.

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u/bassfetish May 04 '21

Not to mention that the grocer knows your mother and father and would certainly raise an eyebrow or two at the little kid trying to pass off candy as mom and dad's grocery order.

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u/cbblevins May 04 '21

and it never occurs to them that a minimum wage today is like on average 7-8 bucks and a hamburger is fucking $5 lmao how do you not see the problem here

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u/su5 May 04 '21

My grandfather's friend used to brag that he paid for medical school by lifeguarding over the summer. Nothing could be said to help him understand that doesn't work today and he is a doctor so should be smarter

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

Holy shit I couldn't pay for medical school robbing people all summer...

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u/FrenchFriesOrToast May 04 '21

You should start with a robbery workshop over a weekend, then one summer season and after that medical school

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u/Channel250 May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

No no no. See you go to rob one person, but instead you convince him on how easy and lucrative robbing people is. And how, for just a small percentage of his robberies he can be a robber too and make the big bucks.

Then that guy convinces three other guys to become robbers and all of their revenue is now part of your downstream.

You guys are acting like suckers.

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u/84Dexter May 04 '21

Yeah, robberies just don't cut it nowadays if you're paying those insane university tuitions.

You'll need to orchestrate and pull off at least 1 or 2 heists, possibly more if you have a shitty heist crew and someone drops a bag of cash, or crashes the getaway vehicle.

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u/Alphaomega1115 May 04 '21

He does understand, he just doesn't want to so pretends he doesn't.

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u/Raichu4u May 04 '21

It would have to make him back down and admit that he's wrong.

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u/sevenstaves May 04 '21

He's also more disconnected from the every day man due to his wealth. Rich people tend to surround themselves with people of their own socioeconomic status.

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u/airlew May 04 '21

In my experience doctors tend to be real smart when it comes to medical knowledge. However, all that medical knowledge seems to have taken up any other space in their brain for other knowledge.

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u/Betaateb May 04 '21

Just lifeguard for 4 maybe 5 thousand summers, and bam, med school paid for.

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u/LordDongler May 04 '21

I explained this to my grandmother. "I worked part time at the Levi's factory putting pockets on jeans for $2.50 an hour in 1968, and I put myself through school on that. You just need to work hard, you don't need to make a bunch of money"

Coincidentally, $2.50 in 1968 is $19 today as well. I guess it was more common back in the day to pay people a livable wage.

This conversation came about when I complained that it's difficult to find a job making more than $10-$12/hour unless you have a ton of qualifications and experience

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u/AgentScreech May 04 '21

Did the same thing with my mom. She said she was working part time as a waitress in the late 60's. It was equal to $50k/yr in today's money... Part time.

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

Old people just don't understand this at all. And my family can't understand why I moved my family 5000km away to live in one of the ONLY cities in our country that pays a living wage... Our living wage here is about $14 an hour and minimum wage is $15 an hour but some places did NOT do well. Halifax Nova Scotia has a living wage of $22 an hour with a minimum wage of like $11 an hour haha. 124k a year average income vs them with an average income below 32k...

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u/SappyCedar May 04 '21

cries in coastal British Columbian. Victoria's average house price is now 1.2 million dollars, like what the fuck that is not a good thing. At this rate it feels like eventually it's going to get to the point where the only people who can afford homes are the extremely wealthy, then they'll just buy it all and rent it to the shuffling masses. I was talking to my Dad who only just a few years ago bought a small pre-built condo his 50s and he was saying that in the 80s in Victoria he just kind of assumed he would always be able to eventually but a house here, by the 2000s is when he realized he fucked up.

It doesn't even seem to be a city thing anymore tough, it seems like the same problem is slowly infecting the whole country. We visited my girlfriend's tiny Alberta home town last summer, and the prices there were definitely inflated for how small and uninviting the town is.

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

At least you guys have decent wages... My city has an average income of 160k and average housing cost of 427K... Nova Scotia average is 32k in income and the average house is 450k lol.

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u/bolerobell May 04 '21

And most of that inflation was in the 70s too, so it's not like they didn't see their own wages grow dramatically from like the mid 70s to mid 80s.

Not only are they disconnected from the modern world, they completely forget their own personal wage experiences in favor of embracing the outrage de jour.

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u/CoolFiverIsABabe May 04 '21

They never had to face the type of competition that is present today. The fact that many stories are about how hard they worked with their multiple jobs shows not only how abundant jobs were but that they were even convenient enough to be able to space them apart.

Many full time jobs don't have a set schedule so trying to add another if it were available is difficult. I also had to deal with weird shifts because managers were trying to get under their labor budget by doing things like 7 days in a row with 5-6 hour shifts at completely different times so you didn't quite get your 40.

How could you possibly add another job and give them a reliable availability?

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u/DstroyaX May 04 '21

I don't know if it is still like this, but I worked for Starbucks as a shift supervisor. In the mid 2000s policy changed, and I was expected to provide and commit to 60 hours of availability but was only guaranteed 35 hours of work, while making like 10-11 dollars an hour.

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u/Studyblade May 04 '21

Companies will always do whatever they can to benefit themselves, even if it means absolutely fucking over the workers in the process because usually, they can just grab another sap off the street.

This is why we need government mandated living wages, universal healthcare, etc.

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u/AshFraxinusEps May 04 '21

Yep, my parents, before I finally convinced them to cough up a ton of money to help me, thought I could get a 2nd job. I work 6 day weeks and can be called in for overtime at any moment. There is no 2nd job that fits that schedule, let alone one which would leave me a moment of free time

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u/FixedLoad May 04 '21

Good thing you had parents and with money to cough up at that! Mine would sooner sew their lips shut and aspirate the cash vomit.

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u/AshFraxinusEps May 04 '21

Yep, I fully agree I am lucky that my parents have money. And a friend has parents who are gonna help with a few tens of thousands. Otherwise I'd be renting until the day I die, and most I know who don't have parents with money are stuck in that boat. They can earn money until 65+ and would be able to afford a house as they can afford rent. But they can't put the money down to get started, or don't earn the annual income to qualify for post-2008 mortgage rules. It's stupid: 18 yos should be given £200k+ in debt for a mortgage underwritten by the government, and by the age of 50 most will have paid off their house

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

Yea and the funniest part is he worked at a grocery store... and raised 3 kids in a nice house with more than one vehicle in the drive...

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u/Lifesagame81 May 04 '21

To be fair, if you get into a mid to high level store supervisor/manager level today, you could probably afford your individual health care premium, renting a 1 bedroom apartment, and have enough money left over to feed yourself and maybe sock away a couple of hundred dollars each month. In 42 years you could spring for a down payment on a home in the suburbs of the suburbs.

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u/skippyfa May 04 '21

His name? Alan Mathews

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u/earfullofcorn May 04 '21

Exactly what I thought of!!! :D

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u/TheConboy22 May 04 '21

It's almost like it's by design...

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u/bolerobell May 04 '21

More like evolution and short sightedness. I don't think our grandparents and parents purposefully sought to create an awful employment environment for their offspring.

I think they wanted theirs and didn't give a moments thought to what the politicians they were electing would do to the work environment.

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u/fenringsfavor May 04 '21

Oh, that sounds good! I’d like one outrage de jour and a side-salad, please! Only $17.50, what a steal!

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u/mrdevil413 May 04 '21

Funny. HS ish time period my buddy and I used to go this diner because simple breakfast was 1.85$. Two years ago I stopped going to my breakfast spot here because an omelette with a side of potatoes and a side of fruit and no bread went up to 17.00$.
Sorry if typing that on mobile gives anyone a stroke

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u/AhoyPalloi May 04 '21

Inflation is hard to understand. It's why old out-of-touch management will fight against giving skilled college graduates 50k salaries.

I like to bring up the calculator whenever I'm feeling out-of-touch, and say... oh, that would have been less than $25k when I got out of college.

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

Wages are different in different places... 50K here would be unacceptable I made well over 60k as a laborer back in like 2009 lol.

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u/Gbcue May 04 '21

Federal minimum wage in 1972 was $1.60. Which equals $10.24 today.

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

I live in Canada and our minimum wage was $1.90 in 1772. which is $12.28 in todays dollars and higher than the minimum wage in MOST provinces today...

EDIT: I would fix my typo but honestly It's just too funny to change that.

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u/[deleted] May 04 '21 edited 29d ago

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

I don't know about that far back but adjusted for inflation to 2011 dollars the median income was 68k in 1980 but only 58k in 2003 🤷‍♂️

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u/fnatikk50 May 04 '21

$1.90 in 1772 was in your root comment

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

The difference is the percentage of people making minimum wage... Even college grads in some fields make minimum now and my grandfather made nearly $3 an hour working at a grocery store...

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u/Invideeus May 04 '21

Yea it's like john thune getting on tv and saying 15 dollars for a min wage is too much because he made 6 when he was young flipping burgers.... But that 6 dollars buying power flipping burgers back then is the same as the 20 I make now switching rail cars for a chemical plant. It's fucking absurd.

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u/AverageCanadianGuy May 04 '21

Right? Aside from inflation prices went up too anyway lol.

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u/Invideeus May 04 '21

Or people that like to blame our generation for being lazy. If I could make 20 bucks flipping burgers I would have no problem getting two jobs doing that to really make some bank. Scheduling conflicts aside there's no way I could do that with an industrial job like I have. I would be waaaaay to fucking worn out physically and mentally.

The money's not the only thing that's not there for us, it's the opportunity as well.

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u/nursekitty22 May 04 '21

Yes and doesn’t take into consideration the massive inflation of real estate, food, basic necessities, etc. We are smart with our money and make $140,000 combo household income and have a decent house but I still buy so much stuff second hand and am always making sure we are wise with our money. And I never buy nice shit and we drive older vehicles that are both second hand.

Also, it’s fucked what we are seeing houses go for right now. The house down the road sold for $150K over asking price!!!! It’s honestly depressing for my kids. We set them up already for saving for their future houses in some low risk stocks and they’re only 2 , hahaha. Fuck!! Life is so expensive!!

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u/eaja May 04 '21

tell you kids, back in my day, we had it so rough... or so much better, i can't tell anymore. anyway, every day, we would wake up at 2 in the morning and go to the table for breakfast. we all lived in a closet, you see, so it was one room. and we would ask, me and my 64 brothers and 27 sisters, "what's for breakfast mum?". she would smack us all with a shoe and say "cold beans". and if we complained and said "but we had cold beans yesterday" - because we had cold beans every day - she would smack us all five times with a shoe and say "tough its all we can afford. i'm trying to feed a family of 93 with just half a silver buckington", a silver buckington was about the same as half a penny back in the day. then we would head to school. we met up with the johnson kids from down the road, and walked the 1674 miles to school. on the way to school, we had to walk up a mountain so tall it extended to outer space. when we got to the top of the mountain, we would see the peterson boys on their fancy bikes - which they dont make like they used to, and we would race them down the mountain. then, when we got to school at 4 in the morning, the headmaster would come up to us and say "you bloody kids are late", then he would smack us all with the cane 10 times and tell us we had 7 years of detention. then, we went to class, and mr stevenson would say "ok line up kids", then he would spank us each 60 times, then hit us each with the cane 40 times each. then it was 7 at night and we had to walk home. then, when we got home, we'd ask "whats for dinner mum?", and she'd smack us each 50 times with a pan and say "rotten cabage". and if we complained, she would smack us each 100 times with a broom and say "im trying to feed a family of 154 on just one islet sliver, just you wait until your dad gets home" - now an islet silver was worth about as much as a grain of sand. then, when our dad got home from his job at the soot factory, he would hit us all 180 times with his belt. if we had been naughty, we would hit us all another 600 times. then, at 1:58, mum would say "ok time for bed". then, we got into our potato sacks, and she would hit us each with a shoe 8 times before we went to sleep. on saturdays, we went down to uncle bob's farm to work. we would have to walk 345 miles to the bus stop, then catch the route 4 bus for 56 stops. we would get on the bus and pay our fare of 3 teddy roses - now a teddy rose is worth about the same as a flake of skin. then, if the ticket inspector came to us, he would hit us all 4 times with his baton. if any of us had lost our ticket, we would hit us all 10 times again and throw us off the bus and we had to walk the rest of the way. when we got to the farm, uncle bob would drive to the gate in his tractor, hit us all 780 times with his crowbar, and tell us to get in his trailer so he could drive us to the farm house. then, we had to plow the fields with a toothbrush in the blazing summer heat - now, they dont make summers like they used to, so it was about 1345.4 degrees spencer, or 67 degrees centigrade using your new-fangled metric system. then, we would have to milk the cows - now, they dont make cows like they used to, so each cow weighed about 459 hog's heads, or 3.2 tonnes in your new-fangled metric system. if you touched a cows udder, it would kick you and you would die, so you had to be really careful when you milked the cows. then, when we were done, uncle bob would say "ok kids time for your pocket money". he would give us each 9 copper jemimahs - which are worth about one political promise each - and beat us each 6 times with his tractor before we left. on sundays, we would meet the johnson boys and go down to the river - now, they don't make rivers like they used to, so this river was about as wide as the whole of america, and as deep as the marianas trench, and it was filled with liquid tungsten. we would play by the old oak tree near the river, climbing on it and building tree houses and such. now - they don't make trees like they used to, so this tree had a trunk as thick as a city, and was tall enough that the branches on the top could scrape the moon. one day, little jimmy fell from the top of the tree. when he hit the ground, the only bit of his body we could recognise was his left eyeball. we picked up all his bits and rushed him to the doctors surgery. dr james said "oh its just a scratch little jimmy dont worry pop a plaster on it and you'll be right" and he gave little jimmy a plaster and a lollipop and he was ok. after we finished playing by the river, we would go into town and get some candy. now, back in the day, you could give the shopkeeper one bronze winglet - which is worth about as much as a ciggarette butt - and he would give you the entire stock of the store. so we would go and get our candy, and we'd go into the town square and eat it. now, we didn't have any of your fancy food laws back in the day, so there was all kinds of stuff in our candy. bleach, lsd, ecstasy, you name it. so we would always get a little hyper after our candy. one day, when we were hyper, we went up the mr boris's car, the only car in the town, and touched it. as we touched it, we saw dad storming down the street holding his belt. "you kids, having fun while i work all day in the soot factory just so you can have grilled water for tea every night, i oughta smack you all". we were sure he was going to smack us, but then he said "no, i got a better idea, ill take you to see mr henderson, he'll set ya right". now, dad had told us about mr henderson. mr henderson was a veteran from the great war, where he got a really bad injury, but we never knew what it was. dad walked us all down to the pub, and we saw a left testicle propped up on a pegleg. "mr henderson," said dad, "i have some kids here who need a good whooping". then, mr henderson picked up the entire pub, and hit us each 4006 times with it. then, dad said "right, i gotta go back to the soot factory, you kids run on home now". now, by now it was 1pm, which meant it was curfew. while we were walking out of the town square, we heard a man shout "oi you bloody kids, its curfew". we turned around and saw the constable holding his baton. he hit us each 160265 times with his baton, then put us in gaol for 60123865 years. now - they don't make gaols like they used to - this one had 5 mile thick steel walls, and a single hole in the top let in some light. we were in there for about 13526 years, until mum baked the constable some cardboard pie so he would let us out. then, she hit us all 1292 times with a washboard, and grounded us for the rest of our lives. so don't you come complaining to me about nonsense like not playing in dirt or broken glass, pathetic.

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u/1337butterfly May 04 '21

just say that because immigrants are doing jobs for less people aren't getting paid as much.

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u/alexisprince May 04 '21

My parents were the same way, and I had them go through a simple exercise with the promise I’d tell them they were right if they could do it. If they could find job postings for the jobs they thought should be able to buy a house, a Zillow listing of a house, and a Zillow listing of a place to rent while building up a down payment.

They couldn’t do it in very many places, but I did concede that certain areas of the country it was possible. They did admit they were wrong on almost every major city, though.

One note is that my parents are both numbers focused people that just hadn’t run the numbers before.

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u/i_am_bartman May 04 '21

You're lucky to have parents that you can reason with. That's a rarity these days.

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u/yech May 04 '21

Hmm, bringing up numbers? Obviously sounds like a personal attack if you ask my parents.

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u/4RJ56NJ5j2oEtcxyVkOo May 04 '21

Everyone knows the numbers are fake news

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u/itwasquiteawhileago May 04 '21

Fuckin' 12. What is that? Some fake ass bullshit if I ever saw it. "Twelve". C'mon! Who believes this stuff?

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u/username--_-- May 04 '21

Average cost for room and board in college in 77-78 was $2200. '06-'07? $28k..

minimum wage in '77-'78, $2.65. '07-'08? $6.5

Just a reminder to everyone who says "millenials etc just need to pull themselves up by the bootstraps". 1000 hours at minimum wage could fund your school back then. Even at the newly proposed minimum wage of $15/hour. 1000 hours can't even fund your schooling.

FYI those are .gov sites.

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u/BlindArmyParade May 04 '21

Ahh yes. The Trump supporter that is triggered by explaining how numbers work. I'm related to a few myself.

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u/diabloenfuego May 04 '21

Yeah. My parents get all huffy and refuse to further communicate about economics, politics, civil rights, or religion with me because "when I argue, I have all of these facts and figures and it's frustrating to them because they don't have all of their info ready to defend themselves"...as if they ever did.

If mom and dad knew their bullshit wasn't bullshit, they'd be able to prove it. This is the difference between people who simply choose to believe what they want because it fits their painted version of the world, and those that still live in reality and want to know why things are fucked.

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u/disisathrowaway May 04 '21

"when I argue, I have all of these facts and figures and it's frustrating to them because they don't have all of their info ready to defend themselves"

Dude same. And then you counter with, "Then you're just making up your mind on your gut and not the actual data!" and then they get REAL mad.

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u/SlowRollingBoil May 04 '21

It takes a certain something to be able to admit that what you thought about the world was wrong. It's multifaceted. They have to admit that not only is their world view wrong but they were buying propaganda the whole time. They fucked up along with their generation. They tought you wrong as well. They perpetuated lies. They were selfish. Their grandkids will grow up in the real world they want to deny exists. Etc. Etc.

It's easier to just go back to the internal, fake reality they've constructed.

These people don't want to suffer the trauma of real life.

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u/DABBERWOCKY May 04 '21

Damn I guess I’m lucky. My parents have been telling me that their generation fucked up the world since I was 5.

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u/dookiebuttholepeepee May 04 '21

Where y’all getting your parents from? Damn. Y’all need a do over in life.

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u/Iamatworkgoaway May 04 '21

but I did concede that certain areas of the country it was possible.

This right here, NIMBY has choked many areas of the country. I live in a stable smallish under 100k town in the midwest. Employers are bussing in people from a major city because they cant find anybody local. Houses are under 150k for 3-4 bedrooms, and at 50 for a old school starter. Have an international airport 45min away.

My mom lives in an expensive area that used to be reasonable, and wonders why we wouldn't move closer. Im like I don't want to work 60hrs a week to afford half the house, and deal with 4x the people. Sell your over priced house, and live like a king near your grandkids if its that important.

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u/saltlakeshady May 04 '21

Sell your over priced house, and live like a king near your grandkids if its that important.

This is the truth and if she was smart she would do this. I know a couple that sold their house in Seattle for a Mil, then moved here to Texas and bought a house for $200k cash. Sure they make less money here but it doesn't matter very much with all that cash in the bank.

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u/rdxj May 04 '21

Hopefully the rest isn't in the bank, but in something that will get them more than 0.05% interest.

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u/SoulUnison May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

My mom’s on her deathbed and my boomer eldest brother is trustee of her estate and somehow got her power of attorney. Despite the fact that he’s slated to inherit a 1.2 million dollar rental property and he currently lives in a house he designed and was built and financed by our parents, he decided to hire a moving crew to empty out my mom’s home which is/was stated in the estate documents to be left to me with the right to deny any attempts to sell it off. Then he turned around and sold it over the course of a weekend to one of those “Need cash fast? We’ll buy your house on the spot” property-flipping firms for hundreds of thousands less than it was worth. I’m the only one of my siblings that’s adopted, I’m less than half his age, and he’s decided that’s a rung lower on the ladder than the “real” kids. Like, he’s not even trying to be coy or clever about it. He straight up admits he committed some fairly serious fiduciary breaches and frauds to destroy my inheritance out of jealousy and spite. He told me I’ve been “inserting myself into things that don’t concern me” since I was born.

He has nothing of his own, really. I’m afraid the damage might be irreversible since he has nothing to use to pay damages. He doesn’t seem to care if he goes down blazing as long as he takes people with him, and at 81, who knows if he’ll even stay coherent or alive enough for court proceedings.

Some people are just broken inside and want nothing more than for the world to reflect them.

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u/Veloreyn May 04 '21

Well, some lawyer somewhere just got a boner and doesn't know why yet.

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u/Tnecniw May 04 '21

I think you could legit contact a lawyer and have that fixed...
Not sure tho.

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u/Dr_Esquire May 04 '21

If this is in the US, you can look up estate lawyers. They can help with issues and it isnt illegal for them to work on contingency, so you pay out of recovered/awarded money. It may seem like you think the guy has nothing on value, but if he has anything in his name, that is up for grabs with limited protection depending on what it is.

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u/iamasecretthrowaway May 04 '21

On the plus side, you can sue his estate if he dies. Sounds like he's got a $1.2 million apartment to help cover the damages.

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u/Tattycakes May 04 '21

But you're still suing him for his violations, frauds and breaches, right? That stuff is YOURS.

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u/SoulUnison May 04 '21

There’s a petition filed and awaiting a hearing date, but this whole thing is so confusing and complicated and who knows how long things could take.

There’s a request that he not be allowed to pay for his legal fees out of the estate he’s managing, though, so I’m mildly optimistic that he has to fold and settle early unable to afford drawn-out proceedings

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u/frmymshmallo May 04 '21

Sorry you’re dealing with all that! Just one thing, oldest boomers are like 75 or 76 years old. I’m Gen X so don’t really care.

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u/Blipblipblipblipskip May 04 '21

My uncle died and left everything to his girlfriend. He had no kids. He had a ton of assets probably in the seven figure range. Multiple corvettes from the late 50s and early 60s, piles of signed hockey jerseys. As well as a house. The catch? That "girlfriend" was his nurse after he was terminal. So my mom and aunts all go to court because he signed his will to her in a hospital bed while on tons of pain killers. His signature was definitely shakey and did not look like he was of sound mind.

The court ruled in the nurses favor. My family got nothing.

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u/Chm_Albert_Wesker May 04 '21

They did admit they were wrong on almost every major city, though.

yea let me just move to the middle of a corn field in South Dakota where I can work nowhere for the rest of my life but at least my house is affordable

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u/365wong May 04 '21

I literally chose a city of 100,000 people in a rural part of a blue state because of this. No regrets.

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u/ajswdf May 04 '21

I used to not agree with this. I bought my house for $57k, was recently renovated so didn't need any fixing up, that was a 20 minute drive from downtown Kansas City with plenty of well paying jobs. This was in 2013, so back then I legitimately could argue that people simply needed to be willing to move to smaller, cheaper cities and they could easily do what you just described.

But times have changed rapidly. My house is now worth more than double what I bought it for, and my neighborhood hasn't gentrified at all. It's still possible here, but even in low cost of living cities it's starting to become harder and harder.

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u/EntrepreneurOk7513 May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

I’m a young boomer. Child is starting out in the same profession I’m in. In the mid 80’s I could afford an apartment near downtown and have money in the bank. Same level of experience and and education, child cannot afford the same apartment. Moving into the suburbs and commuting, they’d be able to afford rent but have $0 for savings. This is not an exaggeration in any way.

Edit— same extremely large, major US city

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u/TurbulentPotatoe May 04 '21

My uncle is an electrical engineer, started in the late 70s. I'm mechanical. He asked me recently about my salary and when I told him he was confused and said "That's what I was making at first job out of school!" All I could add was "Yep"

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u/scraejtp May 04 '21

What major US city? Has the population increased since the mid-80s? Because downtown is probably about the same size.

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u/BrokeOnCrypt0 May 04 '21

You are rare and precious, most other boomers just think we are lazy. Thank you

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u/smishNelson May 04 '21

My parents bought their 3 bed house in 1998 for 80k (UK) and now it's about 350k.

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u/ElevatorPit May 04 '21

Yeah mine too. They were broke ass poor after the war. Dad got a good job made his way to middle mgt and owned a home 2 cars 4 kids each with their own room. Things became so good all they could complain about was taxes. They voted for candidates that felt the same and here we are now. Thanks Mom & Dad!

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u/BeefSmacker May 04 '21 edited May 05 '21

This couldn't be a more perfect snapshot of why things trended toward where things are now. Safe to say that this exact mindset was shared and adopted by well over half of our parents generation, and resulted in cementing themselves in the "conservative" camp. Now this same group of people are adamant that the millennials and younger generations are the problem, thanks to the "conservative" media that they have been habitually subscribed to.

It's going to result in catastrophe, but those that created it will have long since died, happilly and deluded.

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u/SanityIsOptional May 04 '21

People who benefitted from:

  • FDR's New Deal
  • Decreased labor supply due to WW2
  • Increased American exports and technology due to WW2

But who also grew up under McCarthy's anti-communist propaganda, and learning about how everything was the result of their hard work rather than government policies.

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u/RepostTony May 04 '21

My family bought houses in our area for 40K. Now all worth over a million. “aT yOur AgE I hAD a HOuSe. JuST haVe to WorK hARD”.

As I slave away for 12 + hour days at work.

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u/_the_chosen_juan_ May 04 '21

Well you turned out to be a drug lawyer so I’m sure you are going well

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u/khoiytz May 04 '21

I feel personally attacked /s as I read it as drunken lawyer

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u/iamonthatloud May 04 '21

I just don’t understand how they don’t understand. It’s math.

House worth X. Now worth 10 X

Income was X. Now income is 2X

Me: See how things haven’t kept up?

Boomer: yeah but you make $80k a year!! I never made that.

Me: 🤦

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u/jellyjellybeans May 04 '21

I had to explain inflation to my manager in public freaking accounting. Even people who absolutely should know better just refuse.

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u/tertgvufvf May 04 '21

To be fair, I've never met an accountant that didn't call an inflation adjustment to pay a raise, even though it's just keeping you on par. The last couple I've dealt with got really offended when I said anything less than CPI was a pay cut.

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u/Icelegion3000 May 04 '21

Yep. My wife gets "cost of living" increases. Basically keeps pace with inflation. Would be nice to get a meaningful raise after 20 years.

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u/WayneKrane May 04 '21

In one job I went above and beyond, beating all metrics by a mile. At review time they were delighted to give me the highest raise possible. A whopping 3% instead of the normal 2%. I did not go above and beyond after that.

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u/Studyblade May 04 '21

At 60K a year, if you busted your ass for 10 years you would only end up with 7K more per year than someone just getting the COL increase.

And companies wonder why workers job hop instead of stay with the company. Who in their right mind would bust their ass around for 10 years only to get 20K more than they started with, when they could job hop 1-3 times and get 50-80K more.

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u/WayneKrane May 04 '21

Yup, I almost doubled my salary by job hopping. One employer I wanted to stay with but they wouldn’t budge on salary. I was like sorry, I can’t justify turning down a 50%+ raise when you guys have barely given me COL raises.

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u/Studyblade May 04 '21

Gotta treat businesses like they'd treat you: As a means to an end, i.e. getting money and experience to then move into the next role.

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u/armydiller May 04 '21

The sad bit is that your employer likely paid obscene amounts of money to compensation experts just to work out just how many ways they could legally underpay.

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u/cranktheguy May 04 '21

The problem is the disconnect between inflation and the actual price of things. The price of education is rising waaaayyy faster than inflation, and so are home/rent prices in any place anyone cares about.

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u/username--_-- May 04 '21

Average cost for room and board in college in 77-78 was $2200. '06-'07? $28k..

minimum wage in '77-'78, $2.65. '07-'08? $6.5

Just a reminder to everyone who says "millenials etc just need to pull themselves up by the bootstraps". 1000 hours at minimum wage could fund your school back then. Even at the newly proposed minimum wage of $15/hour. 1000 hours can't even fund your schooling.

FYI those are .gov sites.

just copying a comment i made elsewhere. basically education has ~13x. minimum wage has 3xed. if i had to guess housing has probably 8x-ed.

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u/Ok_Opposite4279 May 04 '21

80k is a dream job for many in their 30's......

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u/iamonthatloud May 04 '21

How does everyone know I’m in my 30s lol.

I make more but it’s NY so the argument still stands. If I want a house that doesn’t need work done it’s minimum $500k and I’d rather have some fun with my life/money.

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u/NuklearFerret May 04 '21

I feel you. I make a decent wage everywhere else in the country, but I live in Hawaii. Houses here don’t exist in my price range.

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u/iamonthatloud May 04 '21

Same. Taxes are $25k ish and median income is $110k

And only going up. I’ll rent, live a life I want, not saving for 20 years from now when I could be dead (I save a little)

Eventually the GF and I will take our savings; take a pay cut, and find a place we want to call home

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u/Deto May 04 '21

For a lot of that generation I'm not sure if they were always so dense or if it's just age setting in at this point.

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u/iamonthatloud May 04 '21

For sure.

It’s like describing a color they have never seen. I feel like I’m describing the color red to a dog.

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u/[deleted] May 04 '21

At least the dog usually listens. Maybe doesn't understand, but listens.

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u/umlaut332 May 04 '21

Probably both

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u/whereami1928 May 04 '21

I firmly stand by the belief that leaded gasoline fucked up a whole generation or more.

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u/ElectroMagnetsYo May 04 '21

My grandpa’s still pretty sharp these days and fully understands how the youth are getting fucked by the way things are right now.

I just think the idiots are louder.

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u/swim_shady May 04 '21

You make $80k/yr ... ?

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u/missionbeach May 04 '21

As long as you're comparing generations, your grandparents probably bought their house for $15,000. They couldn't imagine spending $40k on a home.

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u/Awordofinterest May 04 '21

Pretty sure my mum bought her 3 bed 2 bath house for around £2000 (Not a typo) in the 70s. Just valued it at £500k.

Brick and mortar house too.

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u/lajhbrmlsj May 04 '21

Boomers are the absolute worst

Have you tried explaining to them how the economy has changed because of their actions?

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u/paladin10025 May 04 '21

I often think of my boomer aunt and uncle who bought a house in early 70’s in palo alto for around $50k and how not only is that house worth $3.5 million or so AND the property tax is < $1k a year AND they bought a bunch of rental properties in the 80’s in mountain view and cupertino AND a bunch of stocks like apple since hey they seemed promising and were based nearby. Then I think of my cousin the only child...this is some serious lottery level success. If they had instead lived in Ohio...

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u/Kulladar May 04 '21 edited May 04 '21

They also completely ignore taxes.

Tax burden was primarily on companies when they were our age. Now companies pay a small fraction and most of the burden is on individuals.

Government spends more now than ever. That money has to come from somewhere.

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u/lil_shagster May 04 '21

Haha that's nothing - my grandparents bought their London house for 12k in the 70s. Now worth almost a million.

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u/jamaicanoproblem May 04 '21

My in laws bought a two family apartment in the 80s for $240k and now it’s probably evaluated in the $850-900k range. They would walk around the neighborhood telling us oh, this neighbor is selling their house, it would be so nice for you to live near us and the house needs some work so maybe it’s manageable... quick consult with Zillow gives me a list price of $600k (pre-pandemic; probably more now). Oh yeah we just have more than half a million dollars to throw at a house that “NEEDS SOME WORK”

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u/kdholmberg May 04 '21

Hey, don't pick on all Boomers! I've seen the struggle my kids are facing today and it is heartbreaking because the meme has so much truth in it. The majority of college grads today cannot live the way we did when we were building a family in 1982. My husband and I had $30,000 in college debt, one of my sons has over $100,000 just for a graduate program. How do you come back from that? It's hard to see half my kids struggling to pay exorbitant rent & not be able to own their own home. Two out of five kids have decided not to have children of their own because of the cost. That's so sad.

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u/notabillionaire__yet May 04 '21

I'm curious, did your parents buy a house near their parents, or move away?

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u/Dawnoftime_2 May 04 '21

Typical American lives within 18 miles of their mom.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/12/24/upshot/24up-family.html

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u/captain_ender May 04 '21

I live 18 miles from OP's mom!

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u/hooligan99 May 04 '21

From her geographical center? Or from her border? Big difference

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u/LIEUTENANT__CRUNCH May 04 '21

Fucking slammmmed! (high five)

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u/MarshallStack666 May 04 '21

Like unvaccinated kids, this never gets old

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u/3-DMan May 04 '21

What the hell that's almost the exact distance to my mom's house

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u/hooligan99 May 04 '21

Typical.

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u/Jjhockey01 May 04 '21

My sister bought a house 5 houses down from my parents. My brother, like 4 miles down the street. Me.... 600miles away lol

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u/ivvix May 04 '21

wow big TIL! thanks for sharing

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u/mrbojenglz May 04 '21

Fuck that. I'm in the same boat. I can either move away or live in a shoebox. Absolutely nothing affordable by me.

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u/Mountainbranch May 04 '21

I feel like, for me at least, investing in a house is kinda pointless considering my retirement plan is global societal collapse.

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